Of which the following stands out: 120W power handling & "easily" achieving 100dB listening volumes... hmm, so maybe I'm being too conservative?
So, I plugged in my far more powerful PA2M SE, cranked it up & you're right, it's extremely clean, no hint of breakup & holding everything together with ease... in fact, I can turn it up much more than my PA0 SE without things sounding a bit hard or worrying. Before my room got a bit boomy with volume, but things are much tighter meaning I can play louder without fear of upsetting the neighbours. As you mentioned with damping factor, my PA2M SE has *way more* of this (as well as a much larger PSU), which is firmly keeping the Sorcerers under control. Amazing that such little speakers respond so well to so much amplifier.
Thanks!
Well, that's loud enough, I'd say! ;-)
Talking to Colin (@Brain_Dead) about why the SECAs can drive the Royds so loud, he said that it's partly because they have very high damping factors, so don't lose control of the drivers so bashing them into bits (I'm sure he put it more learnedly than that).
He also mentioned something to me about a likely source of replacement Royd drivers a while back. Did he mention that to you @Alan? And, more to the point, do you remember what it was? :-)
No mate, I don't remember anything about replacement drivers - that doesn't mean I haven't forgotten though!
My rig goes considerably louder now it has an active pre, and some very wonderful things are happening in the mid-range, imaging, and percussion. Nowhere near 100dB loud though!!!
I wouldn't want more volume TBH, the dynamic swings can be a bit shocking as it is. More scale, maybe.
Have been listening between Minstrels, Sapphires and Sorcerers for a while now and they can all take more than enough volume. However the drivers must be a lot higher mass than usual speakers due to the damping materials, and the Revelation series' very low 83dB sensitivity / heavy use of 1st order tweeters adds to this. It wouldn't surprise me if people have sent their amp into clipping when reporting damaged tweeters or blowing drivers.
Would think Naim, Exposure, NVA, LFD is where I'd personally turn to for Royds. Although I lose a touch of midrange transparency (you can never have everything!), my 90W dual mono amp brings out a side of all three of the models in terms of bass to midband control & integration, which the similar circuit 50W stereo amp can't match.
The Sapphire and Sorcerers really are a huge step up from the Minstrels especially noticed in the midrange to highs. The Sorcerers have a richness, warmth and room-filling soundstage, but there is an edge given to the Sapphires if you want it raw, fast and 'uncouth' as I've heard people mention this wonderful little speaker. None of them are fatiguing at all (the Minstrel is very coloured though, a bit 'muffled' in comparison), and are very revealing of the system even if they do have their own little say on how the music sounds.
In terms of raw musical communication, the Royd standmounts easily go up against speakers including Amphion Argon, Spendor S 3/5 series, B&W 805, LS3/5A etc. As it stands am happy switching between the Sapphires and Sorcerers and the Minstrels are going upstairs to my daughter's room, she wants a pink Hi-Fi it seems.
One speaker I haven't tried is the Linn Kan, am I missing anything?
Glad you're having a good time with your Sapphires and Sorcerors.
Naim, Exposure and NVA are the usual suspects with Royds, that's for sure - I'm not sure I've heard LFD.
But - sorry if I'm repeating myself here - Class As rewrite the rulebook. You'd never believe how a 12wpc (Green Goddess) or 20wpc (TQ Iridium) amp can run these babies so loud.
Also at the risk of repeating myself - the RR3s are the best small speaker I've heard, at any price. They also would easily see off a pair of current floorstanding Spendors I heard recently.
I'm glad @Alan more or less forced me to buy them unheard.
Would be interesting to listen to the RR3 for sure, my Sorcerers have the same drivers, and are certainly a significant overall step up from the Sapphires. Sometimes the mood overtakes me and I enjoy the rawness of them compared to the more natural, bigger sounding, but more civilised Sorcerers.
I was at Justin's yesterday for work, Justin being the chap who sold those Sapphires. His new RR1s are doing the business for him, he seems absolutely delighted with them. However, those Sapphires do have a certain something for sure, and it is pretty raw.
As for Kan's, I understand they can play music, but aren't exactly high fidelity. I don't know if that's fair if not, but I can't imagine Minstrels being less musical, or fun, under any circumstances.
The Revelations are a magnitude of orders more refined than older Royds, but still manage to be fun & fast, especially with enough good power. I tend to agree, that decent class A offers something pretty special in this regard, and is the only thing I have found that wakes them up properly at lower volume. That's not to say the other amps listed above aren't matches made in heaven for Royds. Just that I prefer matches made in Somersert.
You guys should really have a listen to an LFD amp if you get a chance. Although they are simple MOSFET designs, people often compare them to Class A and SET tube amps in terms of their 'illuminated' nature, holographic soundstage and grainfree, liquid mids & highs. They are also extremely open at low volumes, which is critical for me as I live in a terraced house.
I'd love to hear an LFD - their reputation is very good. Funnily, the Class A amps we've been describing are also mosfet jobbies, and can be described in exactly the same way.
Yomanze, Judt caught up with this thread. I liked your comparitive comments on the 3 different Royd models. Never having owned any, or heard many, it's interesting to read your impressions of the differences.
I'd love to hear an LFD - their reputation is very good. Funnily, the Class A amps we've been describing are also mosfet jobbies, and can be described in exactly the same way.
I was just thinking that. Although the LFD site mentions no Class A-ness AFAICS.
Yomanze, Judt caught up with this thread. I liked your comparitive comments on the 3 different Royd models. Never having owned any, or heard many, it's interesting to read your impressions of the differences.
I'd love to hear an LFD - their reputation is very good. Funnily, the Class A amps we've been describing are also mosfet jobbies, and can be described in exactly the same way.
I was just thinking that. Although the LFD site mentions no Class A-ness AFAICS.
Some amps just blur line lines between tube and solid state, class A and class A/B / B. LFDs are some of them!
Hi Alan could you ask Justin if he glued the grilles on the Sapphires? They are in such beautiful condition though thank him for me.
Hi Yo'
I just spoke with him, he reminded me that we did take one of the grilles off once. They are stuck onto rubber blocks, with a weak glue - a sort of semi-permanent fixing. They certainly stuck back on OK.
The grilel frames sit rather snugly within the cabinet rebate, so we worked them out with a thin implement (either a putty knife or more likely a thin butter knife). I believe Joe intended the grilles left on his speakers.
They are in fabulous condition, aren't they? I absolutely loved the way they look and the way those things boogied. Have fun!
Comments
My rig goes considerably louder now it has an active pre, and some very wonderful things are happening in the mid-range, imaging, and percussion. Nowhere near 100dB loud though!!!
I wouldn't want more volume TBH, the dynamic swings can be a bit shocking as it is. More scale, maybe.
Or, better still, pop it out and look for stickers/numbers. It may well be an out of production Vifa.
As for Kan's, I understand they can play music, but aren't exactly high fidelity. I don't know if that's fair if not, but I can't imagine Minstrels being less musical, or fun, under any circumstances.
The Revelations are a magnitude of orders more refined than older Royds, but still manage to be fun & fast, especially with enough good power. I tend to agree, that decent class A offers something pretty special in this regard, and is the only thing I have found that wakes them up properly at lower volume. That's not to say the other amps listed above aren't matches made in heaven for Royds. Just that I prefer matches made in Somersert.
Judt caught up with this thread. I liked your comparitive comments on the 3 different Royd models. Never having owned any, or heard many, it's interesting to read your impressions of the differences.
I just spoke with him, he reminded me that we did take one of the grilles off once. They are stuck onto rubber blocks, with a weak glue - a sort of semi-permanent fixing. They certainly stuck back on OK.
The grilel frames sit rather snugly within the cabinet rebate, so we worked them out with a thin implement (either a putty knife or more likely a thin butter knife). I believe Joe intended the grilles left on his speakers.
They are in fabulous condition, aren't they? I absolutely loved the way they look and the way those things boogied. Have fun!
I have children & a cat - grilles on here.