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Gromit

I've been granted permission from the Minister for Home Affairs to search out a good Garrard 401. Yippee!! (she likes the idea of one of Russ's lovely plinths).

Thing is, I'm not overly full of knowledge where these things are concered but one thing I have heard is that the earlier (raised lettering) 401's are a better turntable, better screwed together, than the later flush, embossed lettered ones?

There are a fair few of each beast on the Bay at the moment, a couple of which I've got a close eye on, but am just after a bit of info regarding them? IF I went for a later 401 would it be that much worse than the early one? Or underneath are the 2 versions pretty much the same animal?

Thanks muchly. :)

Jim

I've owned two 401s but would not consider myself an expert at all. I'm not aware of the any significant differences. But I have heard a few people comment that the earlier ones are slightly better built - though no comment re sound quality was made.

Mine has the raised lettering and I've had it 15 years or so. I got it serviced 2 years ago by Terry at Lorricraft and whilst it looked more clean and tidy I can't it made that much difference sound wise.

Dominic

Hi, the 401's are all fundamentally the same. The differences being the control plate and strobe. There are no sonic advantages with an earlier model. With regard to 301's, they are not built as well as the 401, but because of interest from Japanese audiophiles, the prices have gone through the roof.
Dom

Gromit

Thanks guys - really appreciate the input. :)

Good to know the later 401's are no different under the skin - they seem to go for slightly less than the 'raised logo' 401's. I see one went on a certain auction site at lunchtime today, including a nice old damped Denon tonearm which would've been fun. Looked in nice nick too, all the docs present and correct.

I'll be using mine (when I get it) with an early 3009 II - for a bit of nostalgia more than anything then after a while will start looking for something more modern I think.

This is all Jim's fault by the way. ;)

Jim

Always glad to help :)

As I said to someone recently I consider a well sorted Lenco to be within spitting distance of a Garrard. But they don't look anything like as good. And unless you're very handy arm choice is a bit limited. Lenco 88s and 99s look much better and are easier for arm fitting but are fundamentally 75's under the bonnet.

It would seem the internet has shoved all these prices up. When I bought my first 401 in the early 80s I paid £35.00 and it had sat in the s/h shop for weeks; the guy dropped the price 3 times just to shift it!

Dominic

The SME is a very underated arm. Stick a Denon DL103 on it and enjoy!
Dom

Gromit

Dominic said:
The SME is a very underated arm. Stick a Denon DL103 on it and enjoy!
Dom

This is what I'm picking up from a few sources - and since I replaced the counterweight stub de-coupling (the old one was knackered) the arm's sound has tightened up massively, being less splashy, more detailed and just plain more dynamic. It doesn't sound 'lazy' like it did before, having a much firmer grip on proceedings.

The choice was to either re-plinth my TD150 (which is in lovely condition) or go for the Garrard. I'm very happy with the sound of the Thorens now, but the 401 is an itch I've wanted to scratch for a long time. Of course a TD124 would be nice but they're going for crazy money now - seems like they're well into 301 territory these days.

Dominic

I have to admit I prefer the 401 over the TD124. I find it has better bass than the Thorens, and contrary to what some people have said, the Garrard does great treble. If your SME has the original internal wiring, get that upgraded. The arm will thank you for it.
Dom

Gromit

I've just bought a 401. :)

A childhood (or certainly a teenage!) dream now fulfilled. :)

Dom - will be in touch with you when it arrives, may pop it over to you for a look-over.

Dominic

No problem Gromit.
Dom

Jim

Gromit said:
I've just bought a 401. :)

A childhood (or certainly a teenage!) dream now fulfilled. :)

Dom - will be in touch with you when it arrives, may pop it over to you for a look-over.

Excellent Richard!!

Photos when you can please.

Gromit

Will do Jim. :)

This one's an early raised-logo one - serial's around 9500-ish if I remember, motor unit only. Cosmetically it looks very good indeed in the photos - the mechanical stuff I'm not so worried about as it's all serviceable and I'll get Dom or someone 'in the know' to have a good look over it at some point soon.

Will also be getting Russ Collinson to make up a plinth for it (having seen one of his Garrard plinths before, his work looks gorgeous). Doubt it'll be ready for Scalford but will certainly try to get it there.

Jim

As everyone would expect I'd suggest you ask Russ to make a light and rigid plinth. 19mm veneered board (but not MDF) will sound a lot better than a heavy layered one IMV.

I agree however that his work looks the business, I wish I had his skill for the finished product.

Gromit

Russ does some hollow, veneered end-grain plinths which seem to have a
good reputation - I think they're fairly light. Of course he also does
some solid stuff in wood like cherry which looks unbelievable but these
are 400+ quid.

I'd like mine to look something like the hollow box one (with maple veneer) he's got on his website. It's the one with the 12" Jelco fitted.

Jim

Just went over for a shufty. Plinth10? Looks good. £270 cheaper and will sound better than a heavy weight one!

Hope you can get it in time for Scalford. I'm making every effort to get there this year. I'd like to see/hear your 401. I also want to see/hear Phil's Voyd Reference as well as a couple of pairs of Snell/Audio Note speakers.

Dominic

My own 401 is in one of Russ collinson's hollow ply plinths. I had him make me one with seperate arm board for both 9 and 12" arms. It is ok as plinths go, but the deck will eventually get a slate plinth, when I can afford it!
[IMG]http://i990.photobucket.com/albums/af30/hifimaster/DSC00681.jpg[/IMG]

Jim

At the risk of sounding like a locked groove I wouldn't swap for slate Dom. It'll sound worse mate. IMV slate is one of the worst plinth materials there is. It'll sound heavy and ploddy with a poor sense of timing.

Is that an Audiomods Rega on your TT? If so what do you reckon of it?

Dominic

Yes it is. The Audiomods is one of hifi's biggest bargains. I have had some good equipment over the years, including a SME V, but the Audiomods is far better. Needs carefull setup. I have used a multitude of carts in this arm and all sounded very good. I'm using a Supex 900 super at present into some Nagatron silver step ups.

Jim

Supex 900 - nice!

The Rega RB series must be the most modded HiFi product of all time! Or damn close.

Did you fit the mods yourself or buy one ready done from Audiomods?

Dominic

I purchased a complete arm with micrometer, but have replaced the internal wiring and fitted my own arm cable.

Dominic

I should add, if anyone is buying the kit arm, pay special attention to the bearing assemblies. Overtighten these by a fraction and the arm sounds awfull!

Gromit

Dominic said:
My own 401 is in one of Russ collinson's hollow ply plinths. I had him make me one with seperate arm board for both 9 and 12" arms. It is ok as plinths go, but the deck will eventually get a slate plinth, when I can afford it!
[IMG]http://i990.photobucket.com/albums/af30/hifimaster/DSC00681.jpg[/IMG]

Nice. :)

That's pretty much the exact same plinth I'm after. Once the deck has arrived (hopefully by the end of the week) I'll be in touch with Russ. He's not much more than an hour from me so quite handy.

Dominic

If you are fitting a SME arm and Russ does the cut out, make sure it's in the correct place as per the template. I had one arm board cut for my SME, (I had two extra blank boards made) and will not align a Denon DL103, I need about 2mm for correct alignment. It's gonna be a pain in the *** to re-drill the board

Gromit

Will do Dom - mine will most likely be a 9" arm-capable plinth as I don't want anything too big so I may even not worry about having a separate arm board; it'll be just the SME slot in the plinth which I'd probably do myself to be honest as I've got the tools to do it at home.

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